Jill Parker of EMS wins for Teacher Excellence

by Michelle McCameron
        Jill Parker, Technology teacher at Elizabeth Middle School and sponsor for the Technology Student Association, was formally presented with an engraved plaque for Teacher Excellence at the International Technology and Engineering Educators Association’s annual conference, March 28th, in Orlando Florida.  The Teacher Excellence Award is one of the highest honors given to Technology and Engineering classroom teachers and is presented in recognition of their outstanding contributions to the profession and their students.

EMH, EMS and RCE get best in show, win $2,900


At left, the winning entry by Ben Siekierski

        41 Elizabeth School District students from Kindergarten through grade 12 received a total of $2,920 in Scholarship money at the Annual Air Academy Federal Credit Union Art Banquet that was held Tuesday, April 8 at EHS.  Best in Show Recipients were: Liberty Metzger from RCE, Evan Baker from EMS, and Ben Siekierski from EHS.

 

A stay at home dad runs for Commissioner


by Mike Hettinga, Candidate for Elbert County Commissioner

        I am a stay at home dad.   When Sandi and I got married in 1987 neither one of us was in a hurry to have children.  In fact we were both against the idea.  We had no money, were both students, had no money, enjoyed spending time with each other alone and we had no money.  However we did discuss children and one thing we always agreed upon was that if we did have children, one of us would stay home with them.

        In 1998, I had left my job as a geologist and was trying to start up a furniture making business.  Toward the end of the summer, I received a call from a good friend who had recently moved to Hawaii.  As we were talking he noted that they were having a hard time finding good day care.  I thought about it, talked to Sandi and told her I was selfless enough to spend a month or so in Hawaii to help my friend and his family.

        Truly one of the most fantastic times of my life.  I learned that I enjoyed taking care of kids and began pestering Sandi about us rethinking our position.  She agreed, we moved to Elbert County and had babies. After deciding we wanted to have children we still had to decide who was going to stay home with them.  That decision took about ten seconds since it had always been obvious that Sandi was able to make significantly more money as a software engineer than I was as a geologist or a furniture maker.

        Hence I became a stay at home dad.  An occupation that I still contend is the most amazing and rewarding job I could have ever hoped for.  Oh, and just to set the record straight, Sandi and I still love to spend time alone with each other.  Probably even appreciate it more now.  And God has blessed us with sufficient income for us to be comfortable with a single wage earner in the house.  For that I am truly grateful.

        Will being a stay at home dad make me a good County Commissioner?  The fact is I have no idea.  My job description for being a stay at home dad seems to include; dealing with messes, sometimes mine and sometimes those of others, explaining things to people who often don't want to hear the explanation, and trying to make sure that every action I take benefits someone and helps to make them better at what they want to do.  In the end my success will be measured by theirs.

Have Changed


Heritage Evangelical Free Church of 555 N. Heritage Ave in Castle Rock was advertising its Easter Services with volunteers holding up cardboard signs that appeared, at first glance, to panhandle and ask for money.  However, reading the signs, the Church was advertising that the had changed, to those looking for change.  Spokeswoman Connie Miller said that the campaign was designed to present the reverse of panhandling.

Why Atheists enjoy talking about the bible

by Gary TwoHorse Green
Atheists have long been portrayed as Devil Worshippers, and as lost, unhappy souls who wander without direction or guidance. Actually, we are quite happy. We do not have an imaginary being watching our every move. Nor, do we have to worry about what over Atheists have to say about our lifestyle.
 
We are not God haters for how can we hate what we do not believe in? The vast majority of us have read the Bible from beginning to end and some (such as me) have been able to read the Koran. We read and ask ourselves, "How can they honestly believe this?"
 
A person writes in "If the earth goes 10 feet further from the sun, it will freeze. If it gets 10 feet closer to the sun, it will burn up. God keeps it in a perfect orbit. Isn't God great?" When we respond with, "The earth, at its closest approach to the sun is 93,000,000 miles away and at its furthest it's 94,000,000 miles away." When presented with this information, we are called God Haters and, of course, stupid. We are told to study the Bible and pray for redemption.
 
Most Atheists know more about the Bible than most so called Christians. Because of this, we enjoy getting into discussions about beliefs, the Bible, and everything associated with it. We enjoy this interaction because:
 
We are challenging you to defend your beliefs. When you use talking points or call us names, we know that deep inside, you are also questioning but are afraid to ask for fear of retribution from others. Why? We have heard that Christians are told not to question, not to reason, just have faith and believe. Lockstep.
 
If you believe so hard in a dogma, then defending it should be a piece of cake. You should, by your actions, life style, and choices you make should exemplify your beliefs. You just do not pick the parts you like and forget the rest.
 
You cannot justify forbidding a women from birth control while allowing men to buy medicine to overcome erectile dysfunction. You cannot justify denying a woman the right to terminate a pregnancy brought on by violence. You cannot deny a woman the right to terminate a pregnancy whose fetus may not live because of a birth defect. In fact, you do not have the right to even think you have control over a woman or her reproductive system simply because it goes against your beliefs.
 
The Bible has many rules for women to follow.
 
1 Tim 2:8-11 — I will therefore that men pray every where, lifting up holy hands, without wrath and doubting. In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly array; But (which becometh women professing godliness) with good works. Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.
 
1 Tim 3:14,15; 2:11-15 — These things write I unto thee, hoping to come unto thee shortly:  But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth. Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. For Adam was first formed, then Eve. And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety.
 
1 Tim 5:9,10,14 — Let not a widow be taken into the number under threescore years old, having been the wife of one man, Well reported of for good works; if she have brought up children, if she have lodged strangers, if she have washed the saints' feet, if she have relieved the afflicted, if she have diligently followed every good work. I will therefore that the younger women marry, bear children, guide the house, give none occasion to the adversary to speak reproachfully.
 
Titus 2:3-5 —The aged women likewise, that they be in behaviour as becometh holiness, not false accusers, not given to much wine, teachers of good things; That they may teach  the young women to be sober, to love their husbands, to love their children. To be discreet, chaste, keepers at home, good, obedient to their own husbands, that the word of God be not blasphemed.
 
1 Cor 14:33b-35,37 —  As in all churches of the saints. Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law. And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church. If any man thinks himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord.
 
Eph 5:18, 22-24 —  And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; but be filled with the Spirit; ... Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord. [Can't submit to husband if don't submit to Christ.]  For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body. Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing.
 
1 Pet 3:1-6 —  Likewise, ye wives, [same as in submissiveness to government authorities (1 Pe 2:13-17)] be in subjection to your own husbands; that, if any obey not the word, they also may without the word be won by the conversation of the wives; [God is saying that even for an unbeliever, submissiveness to God-supported authority is a hard and fast rule, not situational, circumstantial, or cultural.] ... Whose adorning let it not be that outward adorning of plaiting the hair, and of wearing of gold, or of putting on of apparel; But let it be the hidden man of the heart, in that which is not corruptible, even the ornament of a meek and quiet spirit, which is in the sight of God of great price. For after this manner in the old time [i.e., not "cultural"] the holy women also, who trusted in God, adorned themselves, [Outward adornment should not be the focal point of a woman's life—rather her life is to emphasize godliness.] being in subjection unto their own husbands:  Even as Sara obeyed Abraham, calling him lord (Gen. 18:12) [2000 years earlier; therefore, not cultural]: whose daughters ye are, as long as ye do well, and are not afraid with any amazement.
 
1 Cor 11:3-10 — But I would have you know, that the head  of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God. Every man praying or prophesying, having his head covered, dishonoureth his head. But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth with her head uncovered dishonoureth her head: for that is even all one as if she were shaven. For if the woman be not covered, let her also be shorn: but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be covered. For a man indeed ought not to cover his head, forasmuch as he is the image and glory of God: but the woman is the glory of the man. For the man is not of the woman; but the woman of the man. Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man. For this cause ought the woman to have power on her head because of the angels.
 
Prov 12:4; 14:1 —  A virtuous woman is a crown to her husband: but she that maketh ashamed is as rottenness in his bones. ... Every wise woman buildeth her house: but the foolish plucketh it down with her hands.
 
Prov 31:10-31 —  Who can find a virtuous woman? for her price is far above rubies. The heart of her husband doth safely trust in her, so that he shall have no need of spoil. She will do him good and not evil all the days of her life. She seeketh wool, and flax, and worketh willingly with her hands. She is like the merchants' ships; she bringeth her food from afar.  She riseth also while it is yet night, and giveth meat to her household, and a portion to her maidens.  She considereth a field, and buyeth it: with the fruit of her hands she planteth a vineyard. She girdeth her loins with strength, and strengtheneth her arms. She perceiveth that her merchandise is good: her candle goeth not out by night. She layeth her hands to the spindle, and her hands hold the distaff.  She stretcheth out her hand to the poor; yea, she reacheth forth her hands to the needy. She is not afraid of the snow for her household: for all her household are clothed with scarlet. She maketh herself coverings of tapestry; her clothing is silk and purple. Her husband is known in the gates, when he sitteth among the elders of the land. She maketh fine linen, and selleth it; and delivereth girdles unto the merchant. Strength and honour are her clothing; and she shall rejoice in time to come. She openeth her mouth with wisdom; and in her tongue is the law of kindness. She looketh well to the ways of her household, and eateth not the bread of idleness.  Her children arise up, and call her blessed; her husband also, and he praiseth her. Many daughters have done virtuously, but thou excellest them all.  Favour is deceitful, and beauty is vain: but a woman that feareth the LORD, she shall be praised. Give her of the fruit of her hands; and let her own works praise her in the gates.
 
That is just a sampling of what the Bible says about women. As an Atheist, I look at these passages and try to imagine what would happen if I were to tell my wife I was the boss and she must be obedient unto me alone. More than likely after laughing herself silly, I would find myself sleeping next to a dumpster.
 
Yet there are men out there who try to use this mumbo jumbo on women and some, very few actually, have success. Personally, I do not see a women, be it a mother, sister, Aunt, Niece, Cousin, Daughter, as being lesser than me and having to come to me for every little drop of information. It is one thing if a lady says, "HEY! How do I remove this virus from my computer?" because not everyone is computer savvy. Yet, the thought of a lady coming to me to ask about what everything means without her figuring it out is scary.
 
I want my wife and daughters to think for themselves and make logical decisions about how to live their lives. They are all adults and so they do not need me running their lives.
 
This is just one thing that makes an Atheist cringe. In this day and age, it's all about equality. You cannot achieve equality with 3,000 year old desert whispers.

A Christian's response to Gary TwoHorse Green's article
by Linda Hobden

 Hi Gary, I thought I'd respond to your article about why atheists enjoy talking about the Bible.

It might surprise you to find out that I, as a Christian, do NOT have an imaginary being watching over my every move either. In addition, I don't worry about what atheists have to say about my lifestyle.

As to your paragraph regarding the su...n's position from the earth; Christians are human just as atheists are. Some are smarter than others. I could probably point to some rather embarrassing things atheists have written also.

You say you like to challenge our beliefs. Why? There seem to be many things you DON'T believe in, so what DO you believe in?

I find it fascinating that you feel it is your duty to tell me what I can or cannot justify. It is very sad when a woman is raped and becomes pregnant from that encounter. But the innocent baby she is carrying had nothing to do with the rape so why punish it by killing it?

In fact, if you have no belief structure, who are you to say something is right or wrong? On what or whose authority can you make that claim? If there is no God, then there isn't any SIN. So if a man wants to rape a woman, he is just following his animal instinct. That would mean there is no wrong or right in what he did. I think I recall your stating something along those lines in one of your earlier posts; that it is ridiculous to think than animals sin. I agree. They weren't made in the image of God so you are correct in stating they don't sin.

You seem to be overly anxious about all the rules the Bible has for women to follow. Since you aren't a woman, and don't believe the Bible, why do you care?

I, and millions of Christian women are quite happy with the arrangement God laid out for men and women. Being in submission to your husband does not make him the boss. Christian men are to treat their wives as Christ does the church. Women can't get any better treatment than that. Besides, when a man and woman start out in life together, they make more progress if they both paddle their canoe in the same direction.

Some of the scriptures you quoted are from the Old Testament. Their culture, their situation, their lifestyle, their language the era in which they live was vastly different from ours. Even the New Testament Christian's life was much different from ours today.

You say you are knowledgeable about the Koran and yet you deride the Bible for its rules for women. The Jews and the Christians were far ahead of other cultures in their treatment of women. In fact, many of the scriptures you quote show that women were not treated as possessions, but with respect.

In Numbers 27:1 when the Promised land was being divided among the tribes, one of the men that had died in the wilderness had not had any sons, only daughters. When the daughters approached Moses they requested a possession among their father's brothers. (Numbers 27:4). The Lord told Moses that the women were correct in their statements, and that they should surely receive a hereditary possession among their father's brothers. For a woman to inherit land was unheard of in that culture at that time, and yet these women were given a share equal to the men, with the LORD'S BLESSING!

If you look at Matthew and read Jesus lineage, WOMEN were mentioned in His line and SOME of the women mentioned were Gentile women.. He was not ashamed to SPOTLIGHT these women and His Word tells us about each of them, with all their "warts". God is no respecter of persons. He loves men and women. He DIED for men and women.

My last thought regarding your article has to do with your distress regarding the Bible and its treatment of women, and yet you say nothing about the Koran and ITS treatment of women. Muslim women are possessions that can be used and discarded or killed. They HAVE no rights. They are not allowed to be educated. If THEY are raped, THEY are KILLED because they have brought SHAME on their households.

I think you have a very one-sided opinion about Christianity while wearing blinders about the Koran. Why is that?

Gary Answers

Thank you for responding to my article! You are a nice lady...but you have an imaginary being looking over your shoulder. Has anyone seen God? Moses supposedly did when he got the Ten Commandments and when he returned his hair was snow white. You more than likely will respond you must believe or have faith God does exist.

That is the time honoured line of a Con Man; The Con Man will try to sell you, say, a chance to quadruple your money by investing in a new company which is poised to take off.  He'll try to tell you this is privileged information to be given to only an discerning few, a real ground floor opportunity. He will be playing on your emotions to possibly have more money than you had before. He says give him $25,000.00 and in six months you will be poised to make $100,000.00 minimum. Over the course of a year, you could make $1,000,000.00 or more. Should you show reluctance, he will say you just have to believe in this new Company and have faith it will thrive.
Of course you will never see this company nor will you ever be able to find its headquarters because it is (Fill in the Blank). Eventually, this "company" is found to not exist and you are out of $25,000.00. Since the "Broker" cannot be found, you are out of luck.

Christians (evangelical and such) will tell you if you believe in God and his son without giving proof of their existence, you will go to heaven. Tithing helps as well, they say.

You may not know this, but I dig Saints. Saints were once ordinary people doing extraordinary things. One of my Favourites is Saint Moses the Black.  Moses was a servant of a government official in Egypt who dismissed him for theft and suspected murder. He became the leader of a gang of bandits who roamed the Nile Valley spreading terror and violence. He was a large, imposing figure. Once, Attempting to hide from local authorities, he took shelter with some monks in a colony in the desert of Wadi El Natrun, then called Sketes, near Alexandria. The dedication of their lives, as well as their peace and contentment, influenced Moses deeply. He soon gave up his old way of life, became a Christian, was baptized and joined the monastic community at Scetes. He became the Patron Saint of Africa. Saint Florian, a Roman Soldier who established the first Fire Department in Rome and thusly became the Patron Saint of Firefighters worldwide. Saint Nicholas, Patron Saint of Children and Mariners. Saint Elmo, Patron Saint of Sailors. Each of these Saints has their bones (Holy Relics) here on earth. We do not have so much as a fingernail clipping of Jesus, who supposedly rose up from the dead and walked away. That sounds to me like a Zombie.

As to your paragraph regarding the sun's position from the earth; Christians are human just as atheists are. Some are smarter than others. I could probably point to some rather embarrassing things atheists have written also." I'm sure you could but you will never hear an Atheist say man rode a Dinosaur.
 
"You say you like to challenge our beliefs. Why? There seem to be many things you DON'T believe in, so what DO you believe in?" I believe in myself and my skills. I believe in my daughters and the things they do which I cannot do. I cannot teach music, I cannot handle a 1200 pound animal or throw bales of hay. I believe in the beauty of a Caribbean Sunrise and the feel of the Trade Winds. I believe in the surprise of discovering a new (to me) culture, its food, music, and people. I believe I do not need a book to tell me how to live my life for I know the difference in right and wrong. My Grandfather, a Cherokee Shaman, spoke of the earth as a living being and how we can learn from the earth to take only what we need, to help those in need, to walk in peace and leave nothing but footprints.
"I find it fascinating that you feel it is your duty to tell me what I can or cannot justify. It is very sad when a woman is raped and becomes pregnant from that encounter. But the innocent baby she is carrying had nothing to do with the rape so why punish it by killing it?" Been waiting for this one. Let's pull on the heartstrings and play the emotions like a fiddle.
No, you are right, it was not the child's fault for the rape. Let's do this scenario;
You are young, engaged and have just been raped. You were lucky you are still alive and have black eyes, abrasions, torn clothes. Being religious, you do not have an abortion and 9 months later you are a mom.  You have to look at that child for the rest of your life. You will be reminded, even on an unconscious level, of that terrible day. No, you won't blame the child, but you will hate how this child came to be. Your future husband, if you are lucky, will be supportive. One day the child may ask you why is he different from his siblings because the man who raped you was a "person of colour". You cannot lie if you are a Christian because Proverbs 14:5:

"A truthful witness does not deceive, but a false witness pours out lies."

Now what? Tell the child the truth and hope he does not act out this revelation in anger? Plus there is this tidbit.
 
Deuteronomy 22:23-24
"If there is a betrothed virgin, and a man meets her in the city and lies with her, then you shall bring them both out to the gate of that city, and you shall stone them to death with stones, the young woman because she did not cry for help though she was in the city, and the man because he violated his neighbor's wife. So you shall purge the evil from your midst."

Yeah. I will let that speak for itself.

Now you get married, but you are not a virgin.

Deuteronomy 22:20-22
"But if the thing is true, that evidence of virginity was not found in the young woman, then they shall bring out the young woman to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her to death with stones, because she has done an outrageous thing in Israel by whoring in her father's house. So you shall purge the evil from your midst. "If a man is found lying with the wife of another man, both of them shall die, the man who lay with the woman, and the woman. So you shall purge the evil from Israel"

"You seem to be overly anxious about all the rules the Bible has for women to follow. Since you aren't a woman, and don't believe the Bible, why do you care?" I believe all people are equal regardless of sex, colour, and nationality. We are all equal and to put restrictions on one group of people just because is wrong and we have a MORAL obligation to erase it. No, you're right, I am not a woman, but my wife, daughters, granddaughter, cousins, nieces, Aunts, et al, all are and I want them to be able to fulfill their dreams without some man holding them down. Wouldn't you like to be judged by your skill set and not your sex?

"I, and millions of Christian women are quite happy with the arrangement God laid out for men and women. Being in submission to your husband does not make him the boss. Christian men are to treat their wives as Christ does the church. Women can't get any better treatment than that. Besides, when a man and woman start out in life together, they make more progress if they both paddle their canoe in the same direction." Working together is called EQUALITY. You ought to try it sometime.

"Some of the scriptures you quoted are from the Old Testament. Their culture, their situation, their lifestyle, their language the era in which they live was vastly different from ours. Even the New Testament Christian's life was much different from ours today." Here come the excuses. The Old Testament is like a lot of laws you will find on Dumb Laws.com; stupid (Culpepper Virginia, No one may wash a mule on the sidewalk. Tennessee, you can't shoot any game other than whales from a moving automobile.) Arbitrary and enforceable. Why? These laws were never removed from the books and because of this you can go to jail. Some localities have been able to remove these laws and have them end up in books of Unenforceable and Quaint Laws. If the Old Testament is no longer valid, why carry it?

"I think you have a very one-sided opinion about Christianity while wearing blinders about the Koran. Why is that?"

Because, my dear, I was discussing Christianity. Did you know Jesus is mentioned in the Koran? "He said: "I am indeed a servant of Allah: He hath given me revelation and made me a prophet. (19:30, Yusif Ali)" Ow,  bet that set your teeth on edge.

"O People of the Book! Commit no excesses in your religion: Nor say of Allah aught but the truth. Christ Jesus the son of Mary was (no more than) a messenger of Allah, and His Word, which He bestowed on Mary, and a spirit proceeding from Him: so believe in Allah and His messengers. Say not "Trinity" : desist: it will be better for you: for Allah is one Allah: Glory be to Him: (far exalted is He) above having a son. To Him belong all things in the heavens and on earth. And enough is Allah as a Disposer of affairs. (4:171, Yusif Ali)

"Christ the son of Mary was no more than a messenger; many were the messengers that passed away before him. His mother was a woman of truth. They had both to eat their (daily) food. See how Allah doth make His signs clear to them; yet see in what ways they are deluded away from the truth! (5:575, Yusif Ali)"

"And in their footsteps We sent Jesus the son of Mary, confirming the Law that had come before him: We sent him the Gospel: therein was guidance and light, and confirmation of the Law that had come before him: a guidance and an admonition to those who fear Allah. (5:46, Yusif Ali)"

"Then, in their wake, We followed them up with (others of) Our messengers: We sent after them Jesus the son of Mary, and bestowed on him the Gospel; and We ordained in the hearts of those who followed him Compassion and Mercy. But the Monasticism which they invented for themselves, We did not prescribe for them: (We commanded) only the seeking for the Good Pleasure of Allah; but that they did not foster as they should have done. Yet We bestowed, on those among them who believed, their (due) reward, but many of them are rebellious transgressors. (57:27, Yusif Ali)"

"Such (was) Jesus the son of Mary: (it is) a statement of truth, about which they (vainly) dispute. 35 It is not befitting to (the majesty of) Allah that He should beget a son. Glory be to Him! when He determines a matter, He only says to it, "Be", and it is. (19:34-35, Yusif Ali)"

And Jesus was no more than a Servant "When (Jesus) the son of Mary is held up as an example, behold, thy people raise a clamour thereat (in ridicule)! 58 And they say, "Are our gods best, or he?" This they set forth to thee, only by way of disputation: yea, they are a contentious people. 59 He was no more than a servant: We granted Our favour to him, and We made him an example to the Children of Israel. (43:57-59, Yusif Ali)"

And finally, Jesus taken bodily into Heaven
 
"Behold! Allah said: "O Jesus! I will take thee and raise thee to Myself and clear thee (of the falsehoods) of those who blaspheme; I will make those who follow thee superior to those who reject faith, to the Day of Resurrection: Then shall ye all return unto me, and I will judge between you of the matters wherein ye dispute. (3:55, Yusif Ali)"
It appears Islam and Christianity have a lot more in common than most people realize.
 
Right down to the degradation of women.
 
That is the neat thing about being an Atheist-we can study what we want and not feel dirty or guilty. We feel empowered.
 
Linda responds again

 Gary, you seem entranced about some imaginary being that looks over people's shoulders. You indeed have a vivid imagination.

Yes, I believe and I have faith that God exists. I don't know what God you think Christian's have faith in but the one you describe isn't Him. He is no con man. He promised the Jews land, a nation and blessings (Gen. 12:1-3) and... has fulfilled them, even though many of the Jews do not yet believe His Son is their Messiah. No other nation in the history of the world has ever been torn from their land and after hundreds of years gone back into their land as a separate, distinct people and the Jews have done that three (3) times. There have been many other nations that have risen and then disappeared and their people have been assimilated into the world population and are no longer a distinct people. And yet in my lifetime God has returned the Jews to their land, as He said He would. Gary, a "con man" doesn't deliver on his promises. GOD has.

If you were once a follower of those who preach the "prosperity gospel" then you would indeed have been scammed. However, if you have really read the Bible you should know that God's covenant to the Christians in the New Testament promises us that the world will hate us, will laugh at us, will treat us as they treated Jesus Himself. None of the apostles were rich. None lived in luxury. Jesus Himself had no home of His own, or place to lay His head (Matthew 8:20) - "The foxes have holes, and the birds of the air have nests; but the Son of Man has nowhere to lay His head."

No true Christian will ever say tithing will help one get to heaven. There isn't ANY work on this earth that anyone could ever do that would get him into heaven. Only faith alone, in Christ alone by God's grace alone will save someone. “For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: not of works, lest any man should boast.” (Ephesians 2:8-9).

In both the Old Testament and the New Testament those faithful to God were called saints. Psalm 16:3" As for the saints who are in the earth, they are the majestic ones in who is all my delight." Romans 8;27 we are told that the Holy Spirit "intercedes for the saints according to the will of God." Revelation 14:12 tells us "Here is the perseverance of the saints who keep the commandments of God and their faith in Jesus." Prideful MEN on the other hand have made quite a business of "promoting" people to sainthood. They don't have that authority, but that certainly doesn't stop them.

You say you don't believe in an imaginary God, thinking I suppose that if you can't SEE Him then He must not exist. And yet you say you "dig Saints" and go into detail about a man called Saint Moses the Black. You tell of him being a leader of a gang of bandits spreading terror and violence. Then you tell of his transformation after hiding among some monks. You tell that he gave up his old way of life, became a Christian, was baptized and joined the monastic community at Scetes. He became the Patron Saint of Africa. God has demonstrated His power to CHANGE lives. He changed the life of Saint Moses the Black. He also demonstrated this power with the Apostles, who were hiding in fear after Christ's crucifixion. But seeing Jesus after His resurrection, these cowardly men became bold. They faced prison, beatings, stoning and many experienced horrible deaths. What changed them? Seeing their resurrected Lord and Savior.

I have never said a man rode a dinosaur. I do believe men and dinosaurs lived on this earth at the same time and that many dinosaurs were still living after the global flood. There are too many "legends" of thousands of people groups that talk about DRAGONS. Where did these legends come from? It makes much more sense to believe that these creatures lived among them. The Bible names two of these creatures, Leviathan and Behemoth. The detailed descriptions in Job don't describe any known living creature but seem to describe what we know of dinosaurs.

I, too, am part Cherokee. I am fortunate that I worship the true and living God. Many false religions worship God's creation, the earth, or His animals, rather than Him. How sad.

I feel very sorry for you. You seem filled with hate. But not everyone clings to bad occurrences in their lives. Some actually put those happenings behind them. There are women who have been raped and raised the child. Does the child remind them of the rape? Maybe, at first. But after seeing this innocent little one grow, giggle, learn to crawl, bring his mom dandelions and all the other things children do, the memory of his conception fades and the truth of his individuality blots out the bad things. Many families today adopt children of all colors. We are all one, you know. There is only ONE race of humans. Our skin may have different colors, but we are all related to Adam and Eve and then through Noah and his family. So you and I are related.

Of course the parents of the child would tell him the truth. Lies only bring about heartache and lead to ever more lies. It is not the CHILD'S fault that his father raped his mother.

The pagans in the Old Testament did many atrocious things. To keep His people from following in their footsteps God used some severe punishments for those who rebelled against Him. His actions may seem horrifying to us, but they were designed to keep people from succumbing to Satan and his lies. If His harsh sentences kept one person from following down the wrong path, then who are you to find fault with Almighty God?

God has in no way stood as a barrier to my dreams or ambitions. We Christian women DO embrace equality. That is the whole POINT of paddling a canoe in the same direction. But just as a man cannot conceive and carry a baby to term and give birth to it, God has created different roles for men and women.

The Old Testament is VERY valuable and IS valid. The Ten Commandments God gave to Moses are used today. Many of the incidents in the Old Testament were pictures of what God had planned for us. The Passover Lamb was a beautiful representation of Jesus' taking on OUR sin as the perfect, unblemished lamb did when the death angel passed over Egypt (Exodus 12:1-30).

You were certainly discussing YOUR version of Christianity, but not that of those of us that worship Jehovah and Christ Jesus our Savior. Your opinion of Christianity is quite jaded. Christianity is NOT a religion as others are, it is a relationship with Jesus Christ, His Father and the Holy Spirit. It is part of our very life. It is something that guides us seven days a week, NOT just on Sundays.

The KORAN may say Jesus claimed to be a servant of Allah, but that doesn't make it true. The Koran was written by a mere mortal man. A man who lies beneath the ground awaiting his judgment. The Koran is a book that commends hatred of others, urges mothers and fathers to use their children to cause the death of others (suicide bombers), encourages its followers to lie and deceive. The Koran describes a god, Allah, that has the frailties of mankind; greed, sin, hatred. If that is the world you want to live in and a god like that is one you wish to follow, then that would be the book for you.

I worship a God who is DIFFERENT than mankind. One who created all we see out of nothing. One who is perfect, sinless, full of mercy and grace and love. One who doesn't preach that we should sacrifice OUR children, but who loved us enough to sacrifice His OWN Son, and that Son lovingly and willingly did it out of love for us. That is another picture that was portrayed in the Old Testament, when Abraham was tested by God to see if he loved his son more than he loved God. God never intended for Abraham to kill his son, and Abraham knew that. Genesis 22:8 "God will provide for Himself the lamb for the burnt offering, my son."

Christ was MUCH more than a messenger. His miracles proved that. The miraculous change in His apostles proved that. The change in your Saint Moses the Black proved that. Jesus is the Son of God, and His resurrection from the dead also proves that. I serve a RISEN SAVIOR, not a dead man with sins and frailties just like me.

The Koran and the Bible are VERY different. If you TRULY read both books carefully, the difference between Allah and Jehovah, between what Allah commands of his followers and what God requests of His, the lifestyle that Allah says is OK versus the pure life God has for His children, the hatred that Allah has for "infidels" and the LOVE Jehovah has for ALL sinners, if you were honest, you would indeed not make such a statement.

Gary's last response

"Gary, you seem entranced about some imaginary being that looks over people's shoulders. You indeed have a vivid imagination."

Wrong. This is from Christians who keep saying God knows everything you do, say or think. That is not the NSA, that is God

"Yes, I believe and I have faith that God exists. I don't know what God you think Christian's have faith in but the one you describe isn't Him. He is no con man. He promised the Jews land, a nation and blessings (Gen. 12:1-3) and... has fulfilled them, even though many of the Jews do not yet believe His Son is their Messiah. No other nation in the history of the world has ever been torn from their land and after hundreds of years gone back into their land as a separate, distinct people and the Jews have done that three (3) times. There have been many other nations that have risen and then disappeared and their people have been assimilated into the world population and are no longer a distinct people. And yet in my lifetime God has returned the Jews to their land, as He said He would. Gary, a "con man" doesn't deliver on his promises. GOD has."

God and his followers are con men. They make promises which they cannot prove. At least when you invest in the stock market you get a report of how your investments are doing. As per "No other nation in the history of the world has ever been torn from their land and after hundreds of years gone back into their land as a separate, distinct people and the Jews have done that three (3) times." I know of Nations who were torn from their land and were never allowed to return. Does the "Trail of Tears" mean anything? It should if you are one of the Fire People. The Palestinian people lost their land to Israel and are today forbidden to even return. If you read the news, Israel is constantly building settlements and pushing people off their land.  Many Africans were torn from their land to come to the Colonies and the West Indies to work on plantations. They never returned to their homeland. Native Hawaiians had their land taken from them by the United States. It is no longer their land, it belongs to the United States and their heritage is now commercialized.

"If you were once a follower of those who preach the "prosperity gospel" then you would indeed have been scammed. However, if you have really read the Bible you should know that God's covenant to the Christians in the New Testament promises us that the world will hate us, will laugh at us, will treat us as they treated Jesus Himself. None of the apostles were rich. None lived in luxury. Jesus Himself had no home of His own, or place to lay His head (Matthew 8:20) - "The foxes have holes, and the birds of the air have nests; but the Son of Man has nowhere to lay His head.""

I never preached the prosperity Gospel. However, Mary and Joseph were rich, filthy rich. They rode a Donkey which during that time was the Mercedes Benz of the time. Rich people rode mules, poor people ate them. During his trial, Jesus was given a Purple Robe which designates Royalty.
"No true Christian will ever say tithing will help one get to heaven. There isn't ANY work on this earth that anyone could ever do that would get him into heaven. Only faith alone, in Christ alone by God's grace alone will save someone. "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: not of works, lest any man should boast." (Ephesians 2:8-9)."

If you do not have faith, you do not pass go, you do not get to heaven. You must believe in something which does not exist.

"You say you don't believe in an imaginary God, thinking I suppose that if you can't SEE Him then He must not exist. And yet you say you "dig Saints" and go into detail about a man called Saint Moses the Black. You tell of him being a leader of a gang of bandits spreading terror and violence. Then you tell of his transformation after hiding among some monks. You tell that he gave up his old way of life, became a Christian, was baptized and joined the monastic community at Scetes. He became the Patron Saint of Africa. God has demonstrated His power to CHANGE lives. He changed the life of Saint Moses the Black. He also demonstrated this power with the Apostles, who were hiding in fear after Christ's crucifixion. But seeing Jesus after His resurrection, these cowardly men became bold. They faced prison, beatings, stoning and many experienced horrible deaths. What changed them? Seeing their resurrected Lord and Savior."

God had nothing to do with Moses becoming a Monk, Moses saw a group of men who had no fear of him and because of this, he joined up with them and learned through discipline how to change his life. I see you had no response of the other Saints.

"I have never said a man rode a dinosaur. I do believe men and dinosaurs lived on this earth at the same time and that many dinosaurs were still living after the global flood. There are too many "legends" of thousands of people groups that talk about DRAGONS. Where did these legends come from? It makes much more sense to believe that these creatures lived among them. The Bible names two of these creatures, Leviathan and Behemoth. The detailed descriptions in Job don't describe any known living creature but seem to describe what we know of dinosaurs."

Creationist, eh? Should have known. If man existed with Dinosaurs, there would be no man because the Dinosaur would have had him for dinner. Dinosaurs came in many shapes and sizes; some swam, some flew, some slithered, some walked, and some are still alive today; the shark, the alligator, the crocodile, are just a few examples. The so called great flood came millions of years after the Dinosaur vanished. The legend of the Dragon is plentiful in just about every culture, especially in Oriental.
 
Oh, the common chicken is the descendant of the formidable Tyrannosaurus Rex. That is evolution. Just like man from primate.

The rest of your missive is just so much hyperbole and you are so closed minded to what really is I feel sorry for you. You talk of equality and submissiveness in the same sentence. You cannot be submissive and consider yourself equal to you husband. Just because you can give birth and he cannot does not mean anything in the long run because you are biologically different. However, if you were a sea horse, hubby would be the one to give birth and care for the offspring. If you were a male Clown Fish and you lost your mate, you would change gender and have sex with your kids.

We are animals, but on a different levels. We have the intelligence to build cities, cure sickness and go to the moon. We have the intelligence to do away with primitive beliefs and one day fly to other planets.

One thing I believe in:
Man Created God to answer questions he could not explain.
 
Linda's response
 
Gary, your description of God is wrong on both counts. First, He is not an imaginary being. If we evolved from animals then where did our conscience come from? If animals don't know right from wrong then how come HUMANS know right from wrong? If it were not for the conscience God placed in each of us and the fact that in His Word, the Bible, it tells us what is right and wrong, then how could that concept evolve? What would be the purpose of thinking something is right or wrong? Animals are happy killing and eating each other and they don't spend time with feelings of guilt for doing so. At the same time feelings of guilt can haunt a human for decades after the sin was committed. So where did the feeling of GUILT come from? Did that evolve also? WHY? What is the purpose of the feeling of guilt and a conscience?

The purpose is to show us how far short we fall in trying to be "good" and to bring us to the realization that we aren't good. It is to open our eyes to our sinful nature and cause us to realize that WE do not have the power to change ourselves. Only God Almighty can do that. God uses the conscience and our feeling of guilt to gently draw us to Him.

Second, God does not look over everyone's shoulder as a nosy neighbor would or our government does. He does not need to. He created us and knows our every thought, our every action. Why does He care? Because He wants us to realize our need for Him. He wants us to know of His love for us. He wants to protect us from feelings such as guilt, worry, anxiety and all the baggage that humans carry as a result. He created us and knows what is best for us. Isaiah 45:9 "Woe to the one who quarrels with his Maker - an earthenware vessel among the vessels of earth! Will the clay say to the potter, 'What are you doing?' or the thing you are making say, 'He has no hands'?

God is not a con man and neither are His followers. Events such as the "Trail of Tears" is the result of sin in this world and man's refusal to submit to a Holy God. As for the conflicts between the Arabs and the Jews, that ALSO is a result of sin. Abraham and Sarah did not WAIT for God to fulfill His promise of an heir but decided to "help Him" by having Abraham go in to Sarah's maid and the result was a son named Ishmael. An angel of the Lord told Hagar her son would be "a wild donkey of a man, His hand will be against everyone, and everyone's hand will be against him; and he will live to the east of all his brothers." Seems to me that prophecy has been fulfilled and demonstrated multiple times over the centuries. Israel was given to the Jews by God Himself. It is His to give.

If Mary and Joseph were RICH, then I have some questions for you. First, why did they use strips of cloth, swaddling clothes (burial clothes), as covering for their newborn son if they were so rich? Why was Jesus born in a manger with animals instead of an Inn, if they were so rich? Why did they offer a pair of turtledoves or two young pigeons as a sacrifice according to the Law of the Lord for their first-born son? That was the sacrifice of the poor, those that couldn't afford a bull, or lamb, or goat. As for the purple robe that designated royalty, WHOSE ROBE WAS IT? The Roman guards stripped Him of His clothes. The robe belonged to the Romans or possibly one of the priests. It was NOT Jesus' robe.

Ah, faith! Many have faith in things that do not exist. It is not the FAITH that saves a person but the OBJECT of one's faith. Mine is in Almighty God and His Son. They most certainly DO exist.

God has EVERYTHING to do with the salvation of men and women. We are sinful creatures and do not have the power to save ourselves. If "Saint Moses the Black" became saved, God's hand was involved in it.

Why are you surprised that I am a Creationist? You claim to have preached the Bible. Did you ever read Genesis? After the flood life on earth was significantly changed. Proof of that is found in fossils all over the earth. It seems that many things grew much larger before the flood. There are fossils of large animals and plants; many times larger than anything known to grow or live on the earth today. That simply shows the effect sin has on everything. Life is decaying. Things are wearing down. When food sources dwindle or disappear altogether, animals die.

Equal (adj) 1. of the same quantity, size, number, value, degree, intensity, quality, etc. 2.having the same rights, privileges, ability, rank, etc. Our Constitution declares that "all men are created equal." But wait! Some men are tall, some short, some handsome, some homely, some strong, some weak, some wealthy, some poor. So just WHERE is all this equality?

The equality lies in the VALUE of each of us, not the size or number or quantity. God created each of us as equals. God LOVES each of us equally. God DIED so that each of us could be given the gift of forgiveness if we would receive it. A man and woman are EQUAL in worth to God. A WIFE is equal to a HUSBAND in a marriage. EACH have responsibilities. EACH have priorities. EACH have capabilities. Their responsibilities, priorities and capabilities are not the SAME, but they are NECESSARY. They compliment each other.

If a marriage is to succeed, be happy, be what God wants a marriage to be, then the HUSBAND is the one who has the final say in important matters. He is not to be a DICTATOR in the relationship. He is to ask his wife her opinion. They are to discuss the matter carefully. They will each see a different view of the matter and God intended for this to be the case. They will pray about the matter. Even after all of this, the husband and wife may not agree on the solution to the matter. Therefore, God, in His wisdom, declared the final decision to be the man's decision. Is his decision always the correct one? No. The woman's wouldn't always be the correct one either. But someone has to have the AUTHORITY to make the final decision. A business will not survive if the two owners are always at odds with each other, and neither can a healthy marriage.

You, Gary, might consider yourself an animal that is just on a different level than the others. The Bible says man was created in the image of God. We are creative. We have a language so that we can communicate ideas and concepts to others and the ability to write down those concepts. We can reason. With language comes the ability to share what we have learned with other humans. We invent things. We are artists, poets, musicians. We enjoy beauty. We are mathematicians, scientists. We use logic. We pursue goals, We like humor. So where did all these things come from? Most of them do NOT give us an "advantage" over other animals. In fact, some of them would be considered a distinct disadvantage.

We have a soul and spirit. God created man to have a relationship with; someone to love that had the ability to CHOOSE to love back, not simply a robotic, built in response.

God gifted us with intelligence. Some waste theirs.
 
Editor's conclusion
The debate could continue, and likely will, but in another post. 

Bowhunting in Elizabeth: expectation vs. possibility


Deer and Loathing in Elizabeth


        What is happening in Elizabeth regarding the deer is difficult to tell. 
        There are numerous deer in and passing through Elizabeth.  Some estimates place the number of deer at more than 2,000, some estimates place the number of deer at fewer than 200.  I spoke with the Office of the Mayor, with the Elizabeth Parks District (not part of the Town), and read several official reports from the Colorado Department of Wildlife, spoke to amateur nature observers, and residents.  And everyone is certain their estimate is absolutely correct.  For my part, I have been unable to verify any of these estimates.
        There are numerous complaints from citizens of the Town that the deer are hazards and destructive.  How many reports and from how many citizens is unknown, as the Police are not returning my calls.  However, it appears that the reports generally allege the deer are destroying private flowerbeds, pooping on front porches, and crossing roads where people are habitually exceeding the speed limit.  It also seems that some of these reports were made by a Town Boardmember who spent upwards of $20 on her flowers. 
        As to the flower beds and poop, there is at best an unconvincing argument made that the constitute a public nuisance.  As to the deer crossing the roads, there is genuine concern from the Mayor’s Office and the Town that, should someone crash into a deer, the Town could be legally liable. 
        For whatever it is worth, it is my opinion that those speeding through the town are more of a public nuisance than the deer ever have been (or will be) and if the speed limit was observed, there would be little hazard of collision.  This I know from personal experience when a deer stepped in front of my vehicle at night while I was obeying the speed limit.
        However, the elected officials of the town generally have decided that the numerous complaints need responded to: they desire to remain elected officials.  The issue was brought up with Elbert County last summer (and covered in the Herald), and since then numerous strategies were developed, including trapping the deer and relocating them, sterilizing them, and one to kill the deer by allowing deer bowhunting in the Town limits at night. 
        For those with little experience in the rural sport of bowhunting, it is a primitive method of using arrows to kill an animal.  Arrows are not very accurate lethal weapons, which is why the US Army has not equipped our troops with them for some time.  And darkness does not usually improve accuracy.  Naturally, this caused some concern among the townspeople, who feared that errant arrows might be found in the morning in the sides of houses, family pets, horses, cars, or teenagers who disobeyed their parents and left the house for an evening stroll.
        There was additional alarm: many residents moved to Elizabeth to enjoy the deer who, fearlessly, walk through town and not only lay down peacefully in front (and back) lawns, but will give birth in the driveway’s bushes, or (apparently) nibble the family flower garden and poop on the stoop.  And bowhunting only results in a kill of the animal 50% of the time (at best, according to researchers in Texas), and presents an inhumane method of extermination.  Hunters were alarmed that the herds would be extinguished, and there would be no more deer to hunt in the forests up and down the central Palmer Divide.  Needless to say, there was other cause for alarm, but this suffices as a list for the reader to understand the issues with the proposed hunting were numerous, and valid.
        The hunters, nature lovers, animal rights activists, the equine community, old car collectors, parents, and disobedient teenage amblers found themselves political allies, and, united in their alarm, came to town hall to – as may be expected – voice their concern that the proposed plan of extermination by bowhunting was not only a bad idea, but perfectly illegal. 
        Foremost among them was Paulette Walker, who prepared dozens of pages of research and legal citations to back up her arguments against the bowhunting.  She was interviewed by the Herald, as well as by Denver area news stations.  And expressed her love for the deer – and all animals.  She is an artist, and moved to Elizabeth for the proximity to nature.
        Paulette Walker’s arraignment will be at 8am on May 8, 2014.
        Sorry to skip ahead like that, but it is a turn in the story that caught even me by surprise as I was covering it.
        The next morning after the meeting a man drove up to her house, and expressing his appreciation for her support of the deer and her several comments that those who dislike wildlife should move to Aurora, took a bag of feed and dumped it on the ground “to help her feed the deer.”  She tried to stop him (she does not feed the deer as that is illegal to do, and they already have enough to eat), but was unsuccessful.  Shortly thereafter, she was cited for feeding the deer, and now faces up to $2,600 in fines, and 90 days in jail.
        Yes, that is a bit harsh.  But Aurora has earned the reputation, despite recent efforts to preserve and enhance their ecology. 
        And the punishments for breaking the law in Elizabeth are shocking, too.  Over the past decade, Elizabeth has undertaken some shocking changes to its town code, with a prohibition on weapons, no more provision for recall elections, an allowance for the Board to convene emergency official meetings nearly in secret with only 24 hours notice, and an astounding number of new regulations and laws – each with their own shocking punishment.  You have read in the Herald how these new regulations have impacted commerce and industry, nearly driving it from the Town entirely.  You have also read about the chilling effect they have had on job growth.  You have also read that the Board cancelled elections, but what is important here to understand is that the frame up has enraged the citizens who were outraged at the stupidity of a proposal (however preliminary it was) to allow bowhunting at night in town because a Jackson’s worth of flowers were destroyed.
        Now, I would be perfectly clear: these people (and the Herald’s readers) know that the Town did not frame up Ms. Walker.  And they are, largely, aware that the bowhunting would not likely be implemented.  However, there is growing fear and loathing of the Town that has resulted in heightened emotions.  Especially now that the elderly Ms. Walker (who is on foodstamps) is facing a crippling fine apparently due to political retribution. 
        Ms. Walker will be pleading not guilty.  She says that she has not, per her rights under the Colorado Municipal Code Rules, been presented with evidence against her, or even told who reported her.  Innocent, she is confident that he will not be convicted, or if wrongly convicted (she would not be the first person in Colorado to be wrongly convicted) at least not so severely punished.  Though if the conversation is allowed to linger, she will express her doubts at the fairness of a trial at the Town Court where the Judge is not elected, but appointed by the same Board whose policies she was questioning.
        She was said there will be a special meeting where the town will educate the citizens on their deer policies, and other policies.  The meeting is not announced to the public, and people invited are asked not to invite others.  When I called, the Town did not acknowledge there was going to be a meeting, but, even though there’s “no official meeting, the Town Administrator will be meeting with people.”  I tried to contact the Town Administrator to understand whether it was an official or unofficial meeting, and whether I might attend without an invitation, but he did not give any information in his voicemail, and did not respond to additional calls.
        I called the Town Police to learn how many accidents and how much damage the deer have been causing.  My call was not returned.  But the Town Manager did at least say in his message that the Police had gotten my call.  At least I won’t wait up to hear from them.
        I spoke with Elizabeth Parks and Recreation District (which is not part of the Town) to learn whether deer are a problem in the parks, and whether they are an asset to the town parks, and how they will manage hunting in the parks.  The manager did not know how many deer are in Elizabeth.  But he did say they are not a problem in the parks.  As to whether he saw them as an asset?  “I see them as a part of the scenery, not an asset.  They are an asset as long as they are not overpopulated.  There is zero problem with the deer, but we are a park, and not a town.”  He is not scheduling any hunts, nor will be. 
        And for now, neither is the Town of Elizabeth, which seems to have understood how dumb the idea was.
        Though the Town Manager wouldn’t talk to the Herald, he did talk to Scripps Media’s ABC Channel 7, who reported, “town administrators say complaints are on the rise and the deer population is out of control. The animals are causing more crashes, damaging more yards and attracting predatory animals like mountain lions.  Other options under consideration are sterilization and relocating the herd. If the hunting option is selected, it would likely occur during hunting season.”
        A straw poll of Herald volunteers and readers indicated mixed feelings about the deer, but the practice of bowhunting at night in an urban area is universally questioned to be sound policy.  Especially when it violates the rights of property owners to control hunting on their lands and mismanages the herds of deer which do not seem to be overnumerous.
 
Is the proposed Elizabeth bowhunting illegal?
The proposed bowhunting appears to violate the 2014 Colorado Big Game Hunting Rules, in particular:
 
#6. It is against the law to release an arrow disregarding human life or property. 
In a dense urban area like Elizabeth, everyone is within a bowshot of their neighbors.  And their neighbor’s dog.  Or horse.  Or car.  Or window… Consider this, bow hunting typically wounds or cripples 50% of the animals (arrows are not very accurate, which is why the US Military has recently adopted the use of guns).
 
#15. It is against the law to pursue wounded wildlife that goes on private property without first obtaining permission from the landowners. 
Much of Elizabeth is private property.  And some people do not work from home.  Would hunters wait until a landowner comes home to continue the pursuit into their front yard?  Consider that in Texas (according to Texas Parks and Wildlife) archers wounded and to retrieve 130 of 258 deer – and this was not in an urban area.  If the Town is concerned about lions now, they will be concerned about flies and coyotes later.
 
#17. It is against the law to shoot from a public road.  Hunter must be 50 feet from the centerline of the road. 
Roads in Elizabeth are not wide, and a hunter would find themselves on private property (with or without violating rule #15 or #26) before going 50 feet from the centerline of most roads.
 
#26. It is against the law to hunt  on private land without first obtaining permission from the landowner.
Objections are similar to Rule #15. 
               
With intimidation and reprisal against those who question the logic of allowing bowhunting at night in the urban area of Elizabeth, we are intensifying our coverage. Please share your story for our new series, Deer and Loathing in Elizabeth.